How do you want your government?

[msmith198025]

Fewer taxes and fewer government services?

Or higher taxes and more government services?

I put government in bold because I think even if the gov. does not provide some things, the demand would be there and someone would offer them.

[fallout2600]

Lower and fewer...

[Skyhi]

None of the above.

I want lower taxes and more services. We'll achieve this with higher efficiency.

[msmith198025]

None of the above.

I want lower taxes and more services. We'll achieve this with higher efficiency.
Doubtful, but it would be good if you were right.

You are not though sky;)

Edit: let me clarify sky. There is a happy medium probably, but I do not think we can have what some want without massive taxes. It simply is not doable like we are doing, and I do not see how we can get the efficiency that we need to support that.

[vurbano]

What we will end up with is higher taxes and less services.

[Skyhi]

Doubtful, but it would be good if you were right.

You are not though sky;)

Edit: let me clarify sky. There is a happy medium probably, but I do not think we can have what some want without massive taxes. It simply is not doable like we are doing, and I do not see how we can get the efficiency that we need to support that.

Maybe I'm jaded.....I had a job that required me to go to the Cuyahoga County (largest in Ohio) courthouse everyday to perform routine tasks involved with the filing of lawsuits (subpoenas, judges sigs on restraining orders, etc). The inefficiency and waste of the system is astounding. If properly managed, costs could probably be cut 30% without sacrificing "service."

I realize I only have experience with one branch of government in one (corrupt) county, but I imagine the situation isn't much better at the federal level in all 3 branches.

I wish I knew how to solve the problem.....the impenetrable bureaucracy seems almost immune to change.

[msmith198025]

I can agree that there are things that we CAN streamline, I simply see nothing to lead me to believe that we ever will.

So maybe I am backtracking a little (although I do not mean to). You idea is a good one, but again, I do not think it will EVER happen.

[sniffin aroun]

I can agree that there are things that we CAN streamline, I simply see nothing to lead me to believe that we ever will.

So maybe I am backtracking a little (although I do not mean to). You idea is a good one, but again, I do not think it will EVER happen.

I agree completely.
but be careful, bear called me jaded and a defeatist
by me stating we were too far down the wrong road.

[Bear Paws]

None of the above.

I want lower taxes and more services. We'll achieve this with higher efficiency. AKA the impossible pipe dream,... Socialism.

[Bear Paws]

Maybe I'm jaded.....I had a job that required me to go to the Cuyahoga County (largest in Ohio) courthouse everyday to perform routine tasks involved with the filing of lawsuits (subpoenas, judges sigs on restraining orders, etc). The inefficiency and waste of the system is astounding. If properly managed, costs could probably be cut 30% without sacrificing "service."

I realize I only have experience with one branch of government in one (corrupt) county, but I imagine the situation isn't much better at the federal level in all 3 branches.

I wish I knew how to solve the problem.....the impenetrable bureaucracy seems almost immune to change. Bureaucracy breeds waste, inefficiency, and mediocrity because those are the necessary conditions for job assurance. In government bureaucracies the incentives for waste, inefficiency, and mediocrity are even greater to ensure job security. In any layered bureaucracy your job depends on you not standing out as efficient. The small fish in a big school escapes indispensability but also attention.

What is the commonality with all the problems and by that placing blame on the cause.. Its Bureaucracy. To solve the problem you need to get rid of as much of the cause as possible.

[Bear Paws]

I agree completely.
but be careful, bear called me jaded and a defeatist
by me stating we were too far down the wrong road.
What? You think your a optimist and forward thinker with that attitude? The house is on fire and all you want to do is pull the covers over your heads and accept your fate as inevitable. If you don't get out of the fetal position, and at least go to the window I can't help you.

[vurbano]

stop the infiltration of human leeches coming accross the border or we will have nothing soon.

[msmith198025]

What? You think your a optimist and forward thinker with that attitude? The house is on fire and all you want to do is pull the covers over your heads and accept your fate as inevitable. If you don't get out of the fetal position, and at least go to the window I can't help you.

What is your course of action Bear?

I think we could change, but do you think people care enough to actually make change anymore? We vote based on name recognition, or we just mark stuff. People in general do no research onto who they are voting for.

Not that there is a big choice anymore. Both sides are the same more or less.

We need term limits. People that have nothing to gain personally by being there. People that are there to do OUR will. It has not been that way for a long time, probably not in your lifetime. For sure not in mine.

I hope you are right, and that the "thunder" is rolling:).