Legalization

[fallout2600]

Here is clip from this morning:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_l7WkFlr8c

Several good points about the amount of money that is wasted annually on the drug war, particularly marijuana.

[Madtown HD Junkie]

I differ for many conservatives in my thinking.
I find alcohol to be much more destructive then marijuana and cigarettes a much bigger killer then both.
I used to be for making it legal, then against it, then for it......
I see some in society not happy if it was made legal as they would move to the next drug and try and legalize the next one.
If it could be decriminalized and the issue dropped for all other forms of drugs, I would be in favor of it I guess.
I find the hypocrisy of not allowing marijuana but allowing alcohol and cigarettes extremely distasteful. I would rather my kids experiment with marijuana then the other 2.


ok...let me have it.

[fallout2600]

Mad, I tend to swing the same way on the issue when concerning marijuana. Decriminalization just makes sense to me, we shouldn't be attacking individual users of marijuana. Its just wasting tax money on non-violent offenses that land people in jail for possession of a weed. Seriously? The govt should focus their drug war on cartels that cause inner city violence, not people who are the consumers.

[Madtown HD Junkie]

I see it as a very tough question to answer. Ron Paul made some good points. I knew many people in college who smoked grass and grew up fine. I knew many people who drank too much in college. Some never graduated and still to this day struggle with booze.
i am not saying marijuana is problem free, it is just a lesser evil then others which are legal.

[fallout2600]

Agree, I remember all my medical school friends in college all smoked marijuana instead of drinking booze because they could wake up hang-over free the next morning. Also, all my buddies that drank booze every night failed out within 2 semesters. It was easy to avoid abusing booze after watching them.

Ron Paul stands up for liberty. Its ashame his own party tried to marginalize him in the elections, his points may have seemed radical to many Repubs b/c of media spin and half of the story, but McCain was a joke for a candidate. Also, if the opponent was a radical leftist, the only way the Repubs could have contented was to run a strict libertarian for president and they didn't, instead they ran a war hero when war was opposed by the masses.

[Carl]

We should tax it and leagalize it, but just marijuana. Madtown HD Junkie you surprise me with the lefty thinking!

[msmith198025]

I also have no problem with the legalization and taxation of marijuana.
As has been stated before, it is no more harmful or addictive than cigs or alcohol, maybe even less so.

I still wouldnt touch the stuff, but that is just me.

[cybok0]

I see it as a very tough question to answer. Ron Paul made some good points. I knew many people in college who smoked grass and grew up fine. I knew many people who drank too much in college. Some never graduated and still to this day struggle with booze.
i am not saying marijuana is problem free, it is just a lesser evil then others which are legal.

The problem is that people don't know when to stop. I agree pot should be legal and no I don't smoke pot.

IMO if they made it legal they would make tons off of it with taxes, they would make it safer then what they would buy down the street and there are many uses for hemp.

Now I do like beer, but I'm not a alcoholic, I know when to stop. I use to get drunk off my ass every week but it never controlled me. When my daughter was born was the end of getting drunk. I do drink beer during sporting events either live or watching on TV, while at a restaurant or a cookout plus after work or on my day off I like to sit on the couch and have a beer.

[Madtown HD Junkie]

I think beer is a must during sporting events! I have about 3 now and am ready for bed:pleur:

[Madtown HD Junkie]

We should tax it and leagalize it, but just marijuana. Madtown HD Junkie you surprise me with the lefty thinking!

it is not lefty thinking. I just differ from most on this. And i could be wrong who knows. I have just seen cigarettes and alcohol cause much more harm.

[cybok0]

I think beer is a must during sporting events! I have about 3 now and am ready for bed:pleur:

You up all night? If so join the club.:thumbup::)

[fallout2600]

IMO if they made it legal they would make tons off of it with taxes, they would make it safer then what they would buy down the street and there are many uses for hemp.


What people often miss out on is the fact that marijuana and hemp are 2 different plants, the plant used to manufacture hemp products is a "brother" of marijuana. The hemp plant doesn't hardly produce any THC or any pyscho-active substances. It just funny how the war on drugs has married hemp to marijuana.


Industrial Hemp
http://norml.org/images/about/hemp_plants.jpgHemp is a distinct variety of the plant species cannabis sativa L. that contains minimal (less than 1%) amounts of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), the primary psychoactive ingredient in marijuana. It is a tall, slender, fibrous plant similar to flax or kenaf. Various parts of the plant can be utilized in the making of textiles, paper, paints, clothing, plastics, cosmetics, foodstuffs, insulation, animal feed and other products (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3397).
Hemp produces a much higher yield per acre than do common substitutes such as cotton and requires few pesticides. In addition, hemp has an average growing cycle of only 100 days and leaves the soil virtually weed-free for the next planting.
The hemp plant is currently harvested for commercial purposes in over 30 nations, including Canada, Japan and the European Union. Although it grows wild across much of America and presents no public health or safety threat, hemp is nevertheless routinely uprooted and destroyed by law enforcement. Each year, approximately 98% of all the marijuana eliminated by the DEA's "Domestic Cannabis Eradication/Suppression Program" (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4354) is actually hemp.

[msmith198025]

I think beer is a must during sporting events!

Of course it is:thumbup: And beach trips. :)

[HDRoberts]

We should tax it and leagalize it, but just marijuana. Madtown HD Junkie you surprise me with the lefty thinking!

Agreed on both counts!

Cigarettes are far more harmful. If anything, they should be banned. They are another prime reason for rising healthcare costs.

[froggigger]

Agreed on both counts!

Cigarettes are far more harmful. If anything, they should be banned. They are another prime reason for rising healthcare costs.

Tobacco won't be banned any time soon. Government would lose too much.

[vurbano]

Tobacco won't be banned any time soon. Government would lose too much.No it is just being taxed into failure.

[froggigger]

No it is just being taxed into failure.

What? You mean higher taxes aren't always the answer?? Say it ain't so!!

[msmith198025]

What? You mean higher taxes aren't always the answer?? Say it ain't so!!
NOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!:free-happy-smileys-

[Madtown HD Junkie]

No it is just being taxed into failure.

agreed.

[HD MM]

Legalized Marijuana would bring in a TON of tax revenue and save the Feds money instead of having the DEA trying to fight it.

Think about how much sin tax booze and cigarettes bring in. Pot would be a nice influx of money to states as well.

If it were legal, it would be with restrictions. No public intoxication, driving under the influence and such. I don't have a problem with that whatsoever. Right now, the company I work for drug tests me, so I can't smoke. If it were legal, you'd bet I'd do my part to stimulate the economy though. :)

[HD MM]

More on drug legalization...


In the face of a growing number of deaths and cases of HIV linked to drug abuse, the Portuguese government in 2001 tried a new tack to get a handle on the problem—it decriminalized the use and possession of heroin, cocaine, marijuana, LSD and other illicit street drugs. The theory: focusing on treatment and prevention instead of jailing users would decrease the number of deaths and infections.

Five years later, the number of deaths from street drug overdoses dropped from around 400 to 290 annually, and the number of new HIV cases caused by using dirty needles to inject heroin, cocaine and other illegal substances plummeted from nearly 1,400 in 2000 to about 400 in 2006, according to a report released recently by the Cato Institute, a Washington, D.C, libertarian think tank.

http://www.thepajamapundit.com/2009/04/more-on-drug-legalization.html

[fallout2600]

I don't see how treating people as patients instead of as criminals wouldn't have a positive effect.

[HD MM]

I don't see how treating people as patients instead of as criminals wouldn't have a positive effect.

Not that I agree with an all out drug legalization, but we can't overlook the overall ramifications of legalizing pot and value of this....

1)Much less strain on our courts/penal system without recreational users in their on our tax dime.

2)Regulation and domestic growing = J-O-B-S

3)Income - If we taxed this at a slightly higher rate than cigarettes, potheads would single handedly pull us out of recession and balance the budget ;)

4)Lessening of the Mexico drug wars - While i know there are other narcotics crossing the border, marijuana is the big cashcow of the lot. Legalizing it and removing the need for cartel distribution would certainly weaken them.

[cybok0]

Not that I agree with an all out drug legalization, but we can't overlook the overall ramifications of legalizing pot and value of this....



I agree that only pot should be legalized, but IMO it wont stop the heavy drug users.

Heroine, cocaine, meth and prescription pills are a big problem, the people who use those wont stop just because pot is legal.

[cybok0]

Maybe this will help.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/68615/family-guy-bag-of-weed

[cybok0]

But you have to keep it out of the work place.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/68610/family-guy-stoned-reporters

[Skyhi]

The criminalization of marijuana is an absolute joke. It is nowhere near as destructive as alcohol. It isn't physically addictive, you cannot OD on it, and as anyone who has smoked it knows, it is no more intoxicating than alcohol. I can deal with people who want both alcohol and weed outlawed, but I just don't understand the pro-alcohol, anti-marijuana crowd.

The fact that it isn't legal on the federal level for medicinal purposes is even more of a joke. I don't think theres any debate that it is beneficial to cancer patients in dealing with the side-effects from chemotherapy. Oxycontin is legal with a prescription and marijuana isn't. That is asinine. Luckily the new administration has decided to stop prosecuting users and suppliers of medicinal marijuana in states where it is legal.

The number of recreational users sitting in prison right now outrageous. Whether you support legalization or not, I think everybody should be offended by this miscarriage of justice. As an attorney, I plan on doing all of my pro-bono work representing these unfortunate victims of the system.

I am not confident we'll ever see the day when it is legalized. The alcohol and pharm. industries have deep pockets and will be willing to spend to keep marijuana illegal. From a more practical standpoint, there are other arguments that will be used to continue the criminalization of the drug. First, I think the expected tax revenues that would result from legalization are a bit over-stated. Because it grows from a seed, I think many people (especially heavy-users) will skirt the system and grow their own. Whether or not this actually would happen may be debatable, but you can bet this argument would be made by the anti-marijuana crowd. Second, and more troublesome, is the concern of driving under the influence. I personally believe that driving while high is no more dangerous than driving after taking Xanax or Prozac, I understand that we don't want a bunch of stoned drivers on the road. Unfortunately, I don't think (correct me if I'm wrong) the technology exists to enforce stoned-driving laws. As far as I know, marijuana stays in one's system for a few weeks and there is no way to tell if an individual smoked a joint 20 minutes ago as opposed to 20 days ago.

[fallout2600]

Marijuana can be detected up to 30-45 days, all depends on the person's amount of body fat. Marijuana hides itself in your fat cells, so light weight skinny people may retain it for a couple of days, but heavy weight people may continue to piss it out for over a month. You are correct though, there is no way to test someone to determine when they were/are high, only if they have been high in the last x number of days.

I see your point on the seed argument, but it seems that it could be rebutted by the fact that people can make their own beer and wine easily, but most don't b/c its more convenient to run to the store.

[Skyhi]

I see your point on the seed argument, but it seems that it could be rebutted by the fact that people can make their own beer and wine easily, but most don't b/c its more convenient to run to the store.


True, but a few plants can create a lot of weed.....

[fallout2600]

Also true.

[Skyhi]

Also true.

I guess they could make it legal to buy, but illegal to grow.....That would be pretty difficult to enforce and kind of defeat one of the purposes of legalization if they were spending money on enforcement, though.

[fallout2600]

If they decriminalize possession, then I would imagine the possession of a plant would be legal. I truly don't see any reason not to treat it the same as alcohol.

[fallout2600]

More interesting numbers:


Marijuana, By the Numbers…
Thirteen states (with a population base of 115 million Americans) have decriminalized cannabis possession; thirteen states (with a population base of 75 million Americans) now have medical cannabis laws. Additionally, more states than ever before are debating cannabis law reform, including California and Massachusetts where legalization legislation have been introduced.
Since 1965, over 20 million Americans have been arrested on cannabis-related charges—90% for possession-only; over 900,000 cannabis arrests are expected again this year.
According to numerous survey and polls, approximately 75% of Americans support medical access to cannabis; 73% favor decriminalizing cannabis possession for adults and 42% of Americans support legalizing cannabis.


SOURCE: http://norml.org

[HD MM]

I truly believe that you'll see marijuana legalized sometime in our lifetime.

Lord knows a lot of folks could surely use the calming-chill effects of smoking a few doobies in today's stress filled world. Maybe we should do this sooner than later before everyone loses their mind.

[Skyhi]

Those numbers tell me that theres big $$$ behind the scenes (from alcohol, big pharma, and privately run prisons) fighting to keep the status quo.

[Skyhi]

I truly believe that you'll see marijuana legalized sometime in our lifetime.

I hope you're right, but for the reasons I listed above, I'm not holding my breath.

[fallout2600]

Also looks like the NORML foundation has big $$$ too:


Boulder, Colorado: I have every reason to believe that ‘4/20′ in 2009 will be the biggest and most momentous one to date as NORML launches 7,770 nationwide TV ads that advocate for cannabis law reform; NORML expects record numbers of supporters to join the organization for the celebratory one-day price of $4.20 (http://420moneybomb.org/) because, I believe, there is a palpable zeitgeist in America right now favoring reform; the Obama administration appears amenable to some cannabis law reforms in ways that no prior president since Jimmy Carter has embraced; and lastly, with NORML’s nearly 600,000 ‘friends’ on Facebook and nearly 67,000 MySpace, more Americans than ever before who are keen on cannabis can create a viral effect that benefits reform.

[Skyhi]

That's good news!